many witnesses view the structure of the organization, and the authority of the governing body , as a model of the first century congregation..if the governing body is, indeed structured similarly to the 12 apostles.
paul provides a good example of how we need to view men such as these.. he admonishes christians to reject any teaching that is different from god's word gal 1:8 "but even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed.".
he shows by his words that the first century leaders, meant little to him.. 2 cor 11:5 "indeed, i consider that i am not in the least inferior to these super-apostles.".
I've been wondering something.
Was Paul even aware at the time he wrote his letters to congregations and his brethren, that his letters were going to be part of some cannonized holy scripture in the future? It doesn't seem like it does it? No prophetic statements really, just management of the primitive Christians.
What reason is there for Pauls letters to be deemed as somehow coming from God, rather than just a (maybe) historical narrative of the early congregation?
i'm writing this here because i need someone to talk to, and you're the only folks i know who will understand.
most of the time i think i'm a pretty happy and together person, but lately, i'll see something that reminds me of my family and i'll spontaneously start crying.
i miss them so much and my heart keeps breaking, and even though i have kind people i work and volunteer with, i feel so incredibly lonely sometimes.
I'm sorry you are feeling the way you do. I don't know much about your story but it appears you are DF'd? Its a shame that policy continues to isolate people from their families....the people that should have the MOST unconditional love for you in the world.
Its not your fault, and even to some degree not theirs. they are captive to a concept. You have awoken with the blue pill,a nd the world is not as you saw it previously. Not easy. Not easy for anyone. There is no magic bullet to fix those feelings. Everyone is different. But think about what you love to do, and do more of it! Make an impact if you feel that is what is missing from your life.
http://www.jw.org/en/publications/jw-convention-releases-2015/.
stephen lett speaks again in the beginning of the movie ... please smb make him shut up and go hide himself.
can they not see how ridiculous he is?.
..that the governing body are only in it for money and power?.
how many of you think the gb are all/some are sincere?.
okay, i know this has been asked before but i can't find the thread and there are newbies here.....and i like the sound of my own voice.
I guess I am in the minority here. I think they are true believers. Deluded, but generally sincere. With everything they do through the lenses they and we were all raised in, they can justify almost anything.....and do.
While I'm sure the attention doesn't hurt, I wouldn't trade places with them. Its not like they can just pull our a few hundo grand when they feel like it and go to vegas.
i met with a good family friend of mine who is a jw but will still hang out with me...apparently after this last time trying to encourage me.
lol.
but i shared a fraction of how i feel about the organization not to disrespect his beliefs, he just went off on the usual well it's an organization run by imperfect men and you can let the people affect you and need to remember it's the right religion and we need to put all that aside.
WalMart is another organization run by imperfect men. Actually they even allow women!
That reasoning is a security blanket. The idea fed to people is that we are "looking at men" and therefore being stumbled. Well.....who else makes the policies procedures and statements if not the men running the show?
My statement to anyone that says this is are we not to test out every inspired utterance? Why shrug off real problems with doctrine and people by saying "its just imperfect people". Its insulting and ridiculous.
Basically.....if someone claims to speak for god, then how they speak SHOULD be under scrutiny like nothing else. I don't understand why that is so hard to grasp.
it's hard to know where to put this link to a polish book some of you older members probably read, while our newer members are seeking answers to questions the watchtower vehemently deny's!
do i put this under "jw scandals" or "jw beliefs"?
for decades without the internet many of us did not have access to all the publications written by early watchtower writers because access was hard, only men like raymond franz jr(god rest his brave soul) had the golden key for entering the library of all publications jws made.. can some of the older members remember people who sold their homes and others who bought things in the summer or fall of 1974 knowing they won't be paying for their purchases because jehovah will destroy all the creditors records when he kills them!
Hey Fisherman,
Hello to you. I can't say i have ever seen anyone take up the mantle of defending 1975 or the culture surrounding it at the time. Good for you.
Since the conversation has gone two way let me separate the thoughts.
1) 1975. I was born after this. I have no first hand accounts to relate. I have no specific qualms to support. I didn't not go to college because of it or max out credit cards (which is ridiculous whether encouraged or not). While I would agree there is no smoking gun that just says the world is ending in 1975, I think it would be disingenuous to suggest that the society did not enjoy the fervor and zeal leading up to that date just in case. Franz at least seemed enamored with it as a real plausibility, and many latched on because as JW's we are always taught we have special insight, and to listen to the slave. So at the very least can you agree that they poured gasoline on the situation unnecessarily by the statements made in assemblies, directly from the GB, and in print? As a footnote lets also recognize that the anti-type of creating days related to each thousand years of human history since creation is also not understood by easily 99% of Jehovah's Witnesses, not has it been explained in decades.
I'm eager for your thoughts.
it's been levelled that the talks you can find on youtube are fake and that they are not the words of morris, such as the one below.
it'd be really helpful to me if there was a way to verify and prove that they are his talks.. cab anyone help?.
http://youtu.be/nr0di9oy_s4.
I think the question would be to the person that if they are in fact genuine comments of AM3, what would that mean to them?
I have heard this guy speak in person several times, and these videos are plain out accurate. the extra theatrics are just that. I'm pretty sure JW survey guy isn't throwing lies out there, knowing they would be picked apart pretty soon.
the onus is really on the person saying they are faked. How? Who? Some advanced voice duplication apostate technology?
http://www.jw.org/en/publications/jw-convention-releases-2015/.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gc7cyswlvwg.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfmuamqiv4k.
I thought the same thing as Billy. the tract "Return to Jehovah" was built to heap on the guilt and get you to walk in. It won't work on anyone who has taken any kind of principled stand.
Basically it says the only three reasons you could have left is that you got your feelings hurt, are depressed and weighed down, or that you are a dirty sinner who thinks you aren't good enough.
You are good enough!......sort of. Come back and go through the process. we promise to be gentle.
I would say many of us here can expect a call very soon with these from your local elder body. Because of this specific line I gleaned.
Consider: With much prayer, this brochure was carefully prepared. It was brought to your attention, perhaps by a Christian elder or another fellow believer. Then you were moved to read it and respond to its message. All of this is proof that Jehovah has not forgotten you.
i had a couple of elders come visit me about an hour ago.
they wanted to inform me that a brother who was well known throughout the circuit had died.
(i actually knew about it but did not go to the funeral) he was about to hit 90 years old, missed it by a few weeks.
Its amazing how every JW (including us at one time), are basically split into two people. there may be a normal caring thoughfl person running the show, but then there is the cult personality that can somehow make it ok in your mind for you to disavow your children for years.
Families are complicated, and there is always more to every story.....but at its root this is believable just as it is. the idea that they don't break up families is insane.
My kids are very little, but there is not a damn thing that is going to make me not talk to them, be in their lives, support them, until the day I die.
so i went to get a burger just now, and a couple of elders from my former congregation caught me off guard.
they started giving me the we feel so sorry for you, you must be so lonely bit.
i kept telling them im doing great and im not lonely but its like they couldnt hear me talking.
Sometimes the desire to not be alone outweighs the desire to hold onto your sternly held standards.
I believe according to the recnt Pew stats, close to 3/4 of the org is women. So yeah.....you could probably be semi-apostate and they would argue the "semi". :)
Keep us posted. This has to be amazing.
